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Home » CHFWeb Forum » HotTopics » Harry Potter Poll #1
Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708242] Sun, 17 July 2011 14:02 Go to next message
Michele (Queen of Cheap)  is currently offline Michele (Queen of Cheap)
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Harry Potter Poll #1[ 74 vote(s) ]
1.I have read at least one of the Harry Potter books and I liked it/think they are okay. 12 / 16%
2.I have read at least one of the Harry Potter books and I didn't like it/don't think they are okay. 9 / 12%
3.I have never read any of the Harry Potter books but I might one day. 8 / 11%
4.I have never read any of the Harry Potter books and I don't plan to. 45 / 61%

I am curious.


Michele, The Organic Queen of Cheap!
(aka Shelly the Swamp Frog)

Happily posting on CHF since 1995


Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708261 is a reply to message #708242 ] Sun, 17 July 2011 15:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Tracy in Peru  is currently offline Tracy in Peru
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I didn't read an entire book, but I read the first four or so chapters of the first book. The writing style was very engaging and the story moved along at a pace that kept you interested. But, we did not feel Harry Potter fell in line with our views of sorcery.


In Him--Tracy
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708267 is a reply to message #708242 ] Sun, 17 July 2011 16:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mary Jo  is currently offline Mary Jo
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I read one as a research project. I enjoyed the writing but not something I would recommend for children.
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708274 is a reply to message #708242 ] Sun, 17 July 2011 17:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
~Janice  is currently offline ~Janice
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I put #4. And I've not seen the movies. However, my 20's dds have read them all and enjoyed them (and the movies). Dh says that he may "someday" watch the movies - if he does I will with him.




TAKE TIME FOR FRIENDS!

Janice T. ~ CHF member since 09/97 ~
Mom to four - ds 28, dd 26, dd 24 and ds 21 - and wife to my sweet husband Richard.
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708289 is a reply to message #708242 ] Sun, 17 July 2011 19:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Lisa L. in Pa.  is currently offline Lisa L. in Pa.
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Haven't read them, have gleaned enough from here and other Christian sources to know that I have no interest in putting the content in my brain.


Wife to dh since '91

Mama to...
DD '96
DS '06
And three babies in Heaven

**Enjoying our 12th year of homeschooling!**

Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708315 is a reply to message #708242 ] Sun, 17 July 2011 22:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
praise2christ  is currently offline praise2christ
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I'm probably going to stick out like a sore thumb, here. I normally do when Christians talk about Harry Potter.

I am a huge Harry Potter fan. I have read all the books several times, have stood in line for the midnight releases of both the books and the movies, and was just at the midnight showing of the last movie on Thursday. In fact, I am in the middle of re-reading the 7th book, now. Very Happy

The writing style is not only very engaging, it manages to be both a wonderful children's book, but work of deep literature that draws references from history, other great works of literature, myth, and fold lore. I have read the books for enjoyment, but I have also studied them the same way I studied other great books when I was in college as an English major. In my opinion, JK Rowling is simply one of the best writers of her time.

I am not blind to the objections that other have against the books. I respect these opinions and would not care to try to talk anyone into seeing things my way. However, having read the books, I do not have these same objections. The magic that is talked about in the book is not like magic in real life. It is something that someone is born with - like brown eyes - not something they seek out. There is no religious element to it. They learn potions like we would learn chemistry or spells like we would learn math. For them, magic is part of the laws of nature. With this, magic becomes background or props to the actual stories and the themes of the books.

The lessons that HP teaches are wonderful lessons about friendship, loyalty, and, above all, love. One overriding theme of the series is that we can't judge others based on their birth and many parallels to the Nazi's can be found in the Death Eaters. Another theme is that the choices we make are what defines us. One of my favorite quotes is when Professor Dumbledore tells Harry, "It is our choices, Harry, that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities." Another is, "You fail to recognize that it matters not what someone is born, but what they grow to be," or "There are all kinds of courage. It takes a great deal of courage to stand up to our enemies, but just as much to stand up to our friends." I could go on and on.

Hopefully, everyone understands that I am not trying to be argumentative, simply sharing my opinion. If anyone has any questions about the books that I can answer, I'd be happy to do my best.


Stacy, mom to 11-year-old boy/girl twins and a three-year-old boy.

"Every man's life is a fairy tale written by God's finger." Hans Christian Andersen
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708321 is a reply to message #708315 ] Sun, 17 July 2011 23:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Michele (Queen of Cheap)  is currently offline Michele (Queen of Cheap)
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Stacy,
Funny you should say...

"...draws references from history, other great works of literature, myth, and fold lore"

I haven't read any of the books nor have I seen any of the movies though I wouldn't rule it out because of what you said.

This is the same thing that drew me in to read Dan Brown's books. Even though they are controversial, they do bring in a lot of facts about the Masons, the Knights Templar, the Catholic church and works of art.


Michele, The Organic Queen of Cheap!
(aka Shelly the Swamp Frog)

Happily posting on CHF since 1995


Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708335 is a reply to message #708242 ] Mon, 18 July 2011 05:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Elizabby  is currently offline Elizabby
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I read the first five books and I thought they were complete RUBBISH. Derivative ideas, morally bankrupt and uninspired writing style. If you want to read fantasy and magic and wizard school books, read "The Wizard of EarthSea" (Ursula Le Guin) or if you want to read fantasy with a Christian message read Madeleine L'Engle. This tripe is neither, and give it ten years and no one will even remember it. Storm in a teacup, not an enduring classic, IMHO. Not even as good as Enid Blyton - who also writes "school" books and leaves much to be desired...

I had major objections to a lot of things in the books, here's a short list of what is in the top of my mind, from several years ago:

- Harry's cousin and uncle and aunt are horrible caricatures, but what he does to them is also unjustifiable. He uses his magical powers on them in a "might makes right" revenge scenario at the start of every book!

- Throughout the books, anyone with lots of magical power or knowledge is completely justified in whatever they do to anyone else, even betraying their friends (as Harry does in the first book). I forget the details, but one of his friends is tied up and left behind because he is inconvenient.

- Throughout the books, rule breaking and pranks are justified as long as they are clever. It is a very "ends justifies the means" world.

- Bad things happen to good people, just because they aren't Harry. In the fifth book (Goblet of Fire) another good guy who worked with Harry to win the cup dies, just because he isn't Harry and doesn't have Harry's magical protection.

- Harry's magical protection doesn't come from his own virtue or actions or character. It is a gift of his mother (who never actually appears as a character.)

- Hermione works hard and is both magical and smart, yet Harry is the hero, for no obvious reason. The message is clear - talent and being a smart-aleck are clearly much better than brains and hard work.

- Sport is glorified as the ultimate success, but this reflects real life so I guess I can't complain too much about that.

I'm sure there's more, but this is what I remember, and after the first five books I was underwhelmed enough to give it away. I asked my sister what happened at the end - but I forget what she said. By then, I didn't care.


Your sister in Christ,

Elizabby

Evie is six, Zoe is four, and Benji is two!

Not online as much these days, contact me through email or my blog if you want to talk to me!
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708351 is a reply to message #708335 ] Mon, 18 July 2011 07:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Michele (Queen of Cheap)  is currently offline Michele (Queen of Cheap)
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Elizabby, why did you read FIVE of them then? There must have been something there that was appealing.


Michele, The Organic Queen of Cheap!
(aka Shelly the Swamp Frog)

Happily posting on CHF since 1995


Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708352 is a reply to message #708351 ] Mon, 18 July 2011 07:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Michele (Queen of Cheap)  is currently offline Michele (Queen of Cheap)
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None of my kids have ever expressed an interest in reading the Harry Potter books nor see the movies. What brought all this up is a lady at work (in her early 50s) is reading the series of books now and that peaked my curiosity. What is the appeal to adults? When Stacy said that stuff from literature and folklore and stuff is intertwined, that would be an appeal for me (and that is why I mentioned the Dan Brown books which are VERY controversial).


Michele, The Organic Queen of Cheap!
(aka Shelly the Swamp Frog)

Happily posting on CHF since 1995


Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708375 is a reply to message #708335 ] Mon, 18 July 2011 09:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Lisa R.  is currently offline Lisa R.
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Great list, Elizabby. I read the first one because MIL was SO insistent that we were depriving our kids, and she wouldn't leave us alone because, "how can you know you don't want them to read it if you haven't read it? After all, it's just the age-old story of good v. evil and good wins out." (The answer to that is, we don't do magic books and the book is about a wizard--and "good wizard," at that. The Bible clearly speaks to that, IMHO, and I just wasn't interested in introducing that to my kids).

But I read it, and she asked me about it, with a look on her face that told me she fully expected me to have changed my mind. I told her it was far worse than I'd anticipated. She was pretty schocked, but my reasons were much like Elizabby's. We'd have nixed the books even without the magic, because Harry is such a rule-breaking brat and not only gets away with it without correction, but is rewarded for it.

I will grant that the books are written in a way that flows...I can see why Elizabby continued in the series...it just goes from one chapter to the next. But that's not the same as quality writing. Harlequin romances are written the same way. Smile


Blessings,
Lisa R.
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708381 is a reply to message #708335 ] Mon, 18 July 2011 10:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
praise2christ  is currently offline praise2christ
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Wow. I couldn't disagree more. I really don't want to debate, but I will offer my view on each of your points. Just a warning that it may contain some spoilers.
Elizabby wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 05:24

I read the first five books and I thought they were complete RUBBISH. Derivative ideas, morally bankrupt and uninspired writing style. If you want to read fantasy and magic and wizard school books, read "The Wizard of EarthSea" (Ursula Le Guin) or if you want to read fantasy with a Christian message read Madeleine L'Engle. This tripe is neither, and give it ten years and no one will even remember it. Storm in a teacup, not an enduring classic, IMHO. Not even as good as Enid Blyton - who also writes "school" books and leaves much to be desired...

I had major objections to a lot of things in the books, here's a short list of what is in the top of my mind, from several years ago:

- Harry's cousin and uncle and aunt are horrible caricatures, but what he does to them is also unjustifiable. He uses his magical powers on them in a "might makes right" revenge scenario at the start of every book! His aunt and uncle walk a dangerous line of abuse. They make him sleep in a cupboard, they make him cook and clean for him, they tell him he is worthless and scum, they allow their son to bully him, they lie to him about his parents, and on and on. All because they fear what is different than themselves. At the start of book one, his cousin punches him to get him out of his way in order to see a snake at the zoo. Without knowing how, Harry unintentionally makes the glass disappear in his hurt and anger, and the snake escapes. I don't see this as "might makes right" but more as natural consequences for the Dursley's behavior. They (the majority) have abused their power, but now that Harry (the minority) is becoming stronger, he is able to stand up to his oppressors. Despite all the Dursley's do to him, Harry still saves his cousin's life in book 5 simply because it is the right thing to do.

- Throughout the books, anyone with lots of magical power or knowledge is completely justified in whatever they do to anyone else, even betraying their friends (as Harry does in the first book). I forget the details, but one of his friends is tied up and left behind because he is inconvenient. I don't see this at all. The wizarding community is the same as any other with people who do right and wrong. Wrongs have consequences. The scene you are talking about (where Nevile is left bound) is an interesting study in rules and when, if ever, it is right to break them. The three friends (Harry, Ron, and Hermione) are leaving after lights out to go stop an evil wizard. What they eventually do could very well have saved millions of lives. As they are leaving the dorm, another friend, Nevile, tries to stop them because he doesn't want to lose house points if they get in trouble. He refuses to let them pass and tries to stop them with force. Hermione says, "Nevile, I'm really, really sorry about this," then binds him so they can pass. He was left safely the dorm. After they stop the evil wizard, Dumbledore rewards them for cleverness, bravery, and loyalty. But, he also rewards Nevile. This is where he says the quote I used above. "There are all kinds of courage. It takes a great deal of courage to stand up to our enemies, but just as much to stand up to our friends."

- Throughout the books, rule breaking and pranks are justified as long as they are clever. It is a very "ends justifies the means" world. There are often consequences for rule breaking and pranks. I can't say that it doesn't happen a lot, but these are unique situations of war. Not everyone realizes that this is what is happening at first. Much of it makes me think of the Resistance during WWII which was rule breaking.

- Bad things happen to good people, just because they aren't Harry. In the fifth book (Goblet of Fire) another good guy who worked with Harry to win the cup dies, just because he isn't Harry and doesn't have Harry's magical protection.Goblet of Fire is the 4th book (not trying to be nit-picky, but just in case anyone wanted to look into it further). Yes, Cedric dies. Yes, he is a good guy. Voldemort (the evil wizard throughout the series) kills him. He does so simply because he is in the way of what he wants (Harry). This is a major turning point in the series. This is when Voldemort comes to full strength. This is when you realize what he is capable of - how little he values life. This, once again, is a picture of how evil people throughout history have acted. They destroy what gets in their way.

- Harry's magical protection doesn't come from his own virtue or actions or character. It is a gift of his mother (who never actually appears as a character.)We do see much more of Lily in later books through flashbacks and such. But, this is actually one of my favorite aspects of the books. No, Harry's protection doesn't come from his own virtue. It comes from his mother's love when she died to save him. Sound familiar? We have no protection from death other than the loving sacrifice of our Savior. This is one of the amazing parallels to the Bible. The way it is treated brings to mind Aslan in the Narnia books.

- Hermione works hard and is both magical and smart, yet Harry is the hero, for no obvious reason. The message is clear - talent and being a smart-aleck are clearly much better than brains and hard work.Hermione is a crucial character. Harry says at least once in every book that he could not do what he does without her. Harry is the hero because Voldemort pitted himself against him. In most ways Harry is very average. Yet, we see that with the help of friends, courage, and a strong desire to defeat evil, Harry can triumph.

- Sport is glorified as the ultimate success, but this reflects real life so I guess I can't complain too much about that.It is certainly shown in a positive light, but I wouldn't say it was the ultimate success at all. In many ways it merely serves as a fun respite from the horrors that they face. In the later books, Harry doesn't even play anymore because he is too busy fighting for what is right.

I'm sure there's more, but this is what I remember, and after the first five books I was underwhelmed enough to give it away. I asked my sister what happened at the end - but I forget what she said. By then, I didn't care.


Stacy, mom to 11-year-old boy/girl twins and a three-year-old boy.

"Every man's life is a fairy tale written by God's finger." Hans Christian Andersen
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708383 is a reply to message #708381 ] Mon, 18 July 2011 10:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Michele (Queen of Cheap)  is currently offline Michele (Queen of Cheap)
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I meant a lady at CHURCH not a lady at work.


Michele, The Organic Queen of Cheap!
(aka Shelly the Swamp Frog)

Happily posting on CHF since 1995


Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708407 is a reply to message #708383 ] Mon, 18 July 2011 12:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sherry in NH  is currently offline Sherry in NH
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I need an "other." I read about half a chapter, didn't find it interesting, and stopped. We kinda avoided it when the kids were younger. As they've gotten older, they've chosen or not chosen to read them.


In Jesus

Sherry from NH
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708508 is a reply to message #708242 ] Mon, 18 July 2011 23:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
elliemaejune  is currently offline elliemaejune
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I read all of the books. They did not feel occult to me, and yes, I know what occult feels like.

My objections were more along the lines of the way the characters lied to each other all.the.time, and how most of the adults didn't seem trustworthy, most of the time, and that the children didn't have good relationships with most adults.

However, I wouldn't ever argue the point with anyone because I understand why HP looks occultic.

FTR, my brush with the occult happened long before HP; IOW, although some children *might* be tempted to the occult because of HP, people have been so tempted long before HP existed.


Born again since 1974
Married to Mr. Ellie for over 30 years
Mom to 2 amazing grown-up dds and 2 dsil
Grandmother to 1 beautiful baby boy

A kitten dies every time you use an apostrophe to pluralize.
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708745 is a reply to message #708351 ] Wed, 20 July 2011 01:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Elizabby  is currently offline Elizabby
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Michele (Queen of Cheap) wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 21:53

Elizabby, why did you read FIVE of them then? There must have been something there that was appealing.


Well, I was on night shift and working with a nurse that had the whole set! I got up to book 5 by the end of the night shifts, so that was it! Appealing? Well, more appealing than sitting awake at a desk all night doing nothing! (I don't like to sleep in the ED because if I get woken I'm sluggish and then I can't sleep during the day.)

EDIT - I see from one of the comments above that I think I only read four. I stopped after Goblet of Fire, which I thought was the 5th book, but if it was the 4th then I only read four.

[Updated on: Wed, 20 July 2011 01:43]


Your sister in Christ,

Elizabby

Evie is six, Zoe is four, and Benji is two!

Not online as much these days, contact me through email or my blog if you want to talk to me!
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708857 is a reply to message #708242 ] Wed, 20 July 2011 15:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ChristyBin AL  is currently offline ChristyBin AL
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Interesting thread,

I haven't read the books, nor have my sons. Ds1 had to watch the first movie for film class, and that prompted him to watch the rest of the series. Younger son watched with him here at home. (FTR, they were 19 and 18 when watching them.)

Oldest son enjoyed them, younger son gradually lost interest, and if my understanding is correct, his interest weakened when the magic, darkness or evil is how he worded it, of the movies progressed.

Both sons commented that the kids were very much 'the ends justified the means' people. And they would disobey but in the end would be rewarded for it.

That's all I can add. Smile


ChristyBin AL
~Wife to HS sweetheart for 24 years
~2 precious sons, 20 & 19 yo

"...but let it be the hidden person of the heart, with the imperishable quality of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is precious in the sight of God." 1 Peter 3:4

Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708864 is a reply to message #708745 ] Wed, 20 July 2011 15:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jamie
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Elizabby wrote on Wed, 20 July 2011 01:21

Michele (Queen of Cheap) wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 21:53

Elizabby, why did you read FIVE of them then? There must have been something there that was appealing.


Well, I was on night shift and working with a nurse that had the whole set! I got up to book 5 by the end of the night shifts, so that was it! Appealing? Well, more appealing than sitting awake at a desk all night doing nothing! (I don't like to sleep in the ED because if I get woken I'm sluggish and then I can't sleep during the day.)

EDIT - I see from one of the comments above that I think I only read four. I stopped after Goblet of Fire, which I thought was the 5th book, but if it was the 4th then I only read four.

I'm giggling you didn't bring something else to read. I can't imagine making myself read a series of 5 if I thought they were dreadful.


Peace
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #708903 is a reply to message #708864 ] Wed, 20 July 2011 18:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Elizabby  is currently offline Elizabby
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Jamie wrote on Thu, 21 July 2011 05:34

Elizabby wrote on Wed, 20 July 2011 01:21

Michele (Queen of Cheap) wrote on Mon, 18 July 2011 21:53

Elizabby, why did you read FIVE of them then? There must have been something there that was appealing.


Well, I was on night shift and working with a nurse that had the whole set! I got up to book 5 by the end of the night shifts, so that was it! Appealing? Well, more appealing than sitting awake at a desk all night doing nothing! (I don't like to sleep in the ED because if I get woken I'm sluggish and then I can't sleep during the day.)

EDIT - I see from one of the comments above that I think I only read four. I stopped after Goblet of Fire, which I thought was the 5th book, but if it was the 4th then I only read four.

I'm giggling you didn't bring something else to read. I can't imagine making myself read a series of 5 if I thought they were dreadful.

It's kind of a silly superstition thing. The saying is that if you bring something to read, you'll have such a busy night you won't have time to read it! Of course, if you *don't* bring something to read, it will be a quiet night! It has always worked for me...

Also, this was at the time when HP was talked about everywhere, and since I love reading and love controversy - I had to read them somehow! I also read Dan Brown's books when they were topical - they were fun, but not serious books. I've also seen "The Last Temptation of Christ" and read that book too - I just can't help myself! If people are talking about it, I like to be able to give a first hand opinion! (Everyone is entitled to MY opinion! Wink )


Your sister in Christ,

Elizabby

Evie is six, Zoe is four, and Benji is two!

Not online as much these days, contact me through email or my blog if you want to talk to me!
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #709052 is a reply to message #708903 ] Thu, 21 July 2011 18:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Lisa R.  is currently offline Lisa R.
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Quote:

(Everyone is entitled to MY opinion! Wink )


Is that a corollary to "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you?" Laughing


Blessings,
Lisa R.
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #709719 is a reply to message #708242 ] Tue, 26 July 2011 16:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dina  is currently offline Dina
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I didnt think i would like it, but i voted #1. When i was in youth ministry... in the young teen years, i went ahead and read it, because folks would not hear my point of view otherwise. I stopped halfway thru the book. I felt it to be quite evil actually. Im sure there are old threads on here... but that is why i even read nearly one of them. I see no need for them in my life.


Dina ....... HE has made me glad!
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #709906 is a reply to message #709719 ] Thu, 28 July 2011 00:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hope  is currently offline Hope
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It absolutely stuns me anytime I hear a christian talking about reading Harry Potter or Twilight, or anything similar.

What are we supposed to do as christians?
That which pleases the Lord.
Moving toward His light, not the darkness.
Reading His word, not wasting time on books that have nothing to do with Him, and who He is.
I could never, as a christian, justify spending any amount of time on any of these types of books or movies.


"I'd like to ask God why He lets poverty and injustice exist, why there are so many orphans and why He does nothing about it, but I am afraid He would ask me the same question." - Unknown
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #709919 is a reply to message #709906 ] Thu, 28 July 2011 06:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Elizabby  is currently offline Elizabby
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Hope wrote on Thu, 28 July 2011 14:52

It absolutely stuns me anytime I hear a christian talking about reading Harry Potter or Twilight, or anything similar.

What are we supposed to do as christians?
That which pleases the Lord.
Moving toward His light, not the darkness.
Reading His word, not wasting time on books that have nothing to do with Him, and who He is.
I could never, as a christian, justify spending any amount of time on any of these types of books or movies.


Are you suggesting you've *never* read anything, or seen any movie, that could be described as a "waste of time"? I find that hard to believe.

Not that I'm suggesting you *should* make time to read these books - as I said above, I thought they were rubbish. However, I find your comment a little judgmental. Presumably your decision to reject these books is based at least partly on comments by Christians who *have* read these books?

I firmly believe that many of my Christian friends have benefitted by my decision to read/view controversial material and review it for them, thus helping them decide whether or not to read it themselves. This is a service I feel myself well suited to do, and not at all at risk of losing my faith in the process. And fortunately for me, I'm not accountable to *you* for my use of my time... Wink

[Updated on: Thu, 28 July 2011 07:07]


Your sister in Christ,

Elizabby

Evie is six, Zoe is four, and Benji is two!

Not online as much these days, contact me through email or my blog if you want to talk to me!
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #709954 is a reply to message #709919 ] Thu, 28 July 2011 10:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hope  is currently offline Hope
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Not judgemental at all, just stating the fact that reading things like this is not at all pleasing to the Lord, and that is how I base my decisions. I cannot, as a christian, ever justify spending time on something He would not be pleased with. Also, no, I never have read or watched tv or movies that would not please Him. In fact, I almost never spend time with tv or movies, as I have too many other things to do like caring for my family, homeschooling, etc. I choose very carefully what I will watch or read. I never sit down and mindlessly stare at the screen for something to entertain myself, in fact, I believe the Lord has taken any desire I may have ever had for that, away. I love books, and only read that which is edifying, and uplifting, and will help grow my faith and understanding of the Lord in some way-so that I can then share with others, serving Him, and sharing the gospel. I won't even read fiction, because I am bored with it. I feel like I don't even have enough time to read His word, because I want to spend so much more time in it than I have, so how could I justify reading or watching things that have nothing to do with Him, or, something like Harry Potter, or Twilight, that goes against the christian faith? We are called to do that which is holy, and right and just, always moving toward Him, and his ways, not the opposite direction. Just my opinion, and it works for me, as I am also a model for my children, and in raising children, I am actually raising adults, and I want them to learn discernment in this very selfish "me" society we live in, so I have to be very intentional in all I do, including the books I choose to read, and what I choose to watch/and, or entertain myself with.


"I'd like to ask God why He lets poverty and injustice exist, why there are so many orphans and why He does nothing about it, but I am afraid He would ask me the same question." - Unknown
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #709955 is a reply to message #709954 ] Thu, 28 July 2011 10:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
praise2christ  is currently offline praise2christ
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Hope wrote on Thu, 28 July 2011 10:48

Not judgemental at all, just stating the fact that reading things like this is not at all pleasing to the Lord, and that is how I base my decisions. I cannot, as a christian, ever justify spending time on something He would not be pleased with. Also, no, I never have read or watched tv or movies that would not please Him. In fact, I almost never spend time with tv or movies, as I have too many other things to do like caring for my family, homeschooling, etc. I choose very carefully what I will watch or read. I never sit down and mindlessly stare at the screen for something to entertain myself, in fact, I believe the Lord has taken any desire I may have ever had for that, away. I love books, and only read that which is edifying, and uplifting, and will help grow my faith and understanding of the Lord in some way-so that I can then share with others, serving Him, and sharing the gospel. I won't even read fiction, because I am bored with it. I feel like I don't even have enough time to read His word, because I want to spend so much more time in it than I have, so how could I justify reading or watching things that have nothing to do with Him, or, something like Harry Potter, or Twilight, that goes against the christian faith? We are called to do that which is holy, and right and just, always moving toward Him, and his ways, not the opposite direction. Just my opinion, and it works for me, as I am also a model for my children, and in raising children, I am actually raising adults, and I want them to learn discernment in this very selfish "me" society we live in, so I have to be very intentional in all I do, including the books I choose to read, and what I choose to watch/and, or entertain myself with.


In this we will have to disagree. I do not believe the Lord is displeased with me reading HP or seeing the movies (can't speak to Twilight since I know very little about them). I do not believe that they against the Christian faith. I know some people disagree, but I have read nothing in HP that is anti-God or evil as some have stated. I see the exact opposite. A story about someone who is willing to fight for what is right, defend the defenseless, and, ultimately, sacrifice himself for others. The magic in HP is the same type of magic that is seen in Narnia or LOTR. It is a completely fictional type of magic, not the magic that people mess with in real life.

So, by stating that what I am doing is displeasing to the Lord, you are judging me. I am completely comfortable with my decision to ready HP and see the movies and do not believe I am displeasing the Lord by doing so. If I felt convicted about it at all, I would be in serious prayer and looking for the Lord's leading. But, I don't. And I have seen nothing in HP that would lead me to believe it is wrong for me to read/watch them.


Stacy, mom to 11-year-old boy/girl twins and a three-year-old boy.

"Every man's life is a fairy tale written by God's finger." Hans Christian Andersen
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #709957 is a reply to message #709955 ] Thu, 28 July 2011 11:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hope  is currently offline Hope
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I disagree, and I heard it stated once by a pastor that warlocks/wizards/whatever are not heroes, or something to be admired, and that is what happens with these books-and it takes their eyes off Christ.


"I'd like to ask God why He lets poverty and injustice exist, why there are so many orphans and why He does nothing about it, but I am afraid He would ask me the same question." - Unknown
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710016 is a reply to message #709957 ] Thu, 28 July 2011 18:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
elliemaejune  is currently offline elliemaejune
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Hope wrote on Thu, 28 July 2011 10:11

I disagree, and I heard it stated once by a pastor that warlocks/wizards/whatever are not heroes, or something to be admired, and that is what happens with these books-and it takes their eyes off Christ.

The same could be said about any work of literature. Are you suggesting that it is an error to read anything except Scripture?


Born again since 1974
Married to Mr. Ellie for over 30 years
Mom to 2 amazing grown-up dds and 2 dsil
Grandmother to 1 beautiful baby boy

A kitten dies every time you use an apostrophe to pluralize.
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710038 is a reply to message #709954 ] Thu, 28 July 2011 21:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Elizabby  is currently offline Elizabby
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Hope wrote on Fri, 29 July 2011 00:48

Not judgemental at all, just stating the fact that reading things like this is not at all pleasing to the Lord,


Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

Because it isn't judgmental at all to claim that the Lord has vouchsafed YOU the ultimate standard by which ALL Christians should live?

Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing


Your sister in Christ,

Elizabby

Evie is six, Zoe is four, and Benji is two!

Not online as much these days, contact me through email or my blog if you want to talk to me!
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710047 is a reply to message #709906 ] Thu, 28 July 2011 22:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Elise  is currently offline Elise
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Hope wrote on Wed, 27 July 2011 23:52

What are we supposed to do as christians?
That which pleases the Lord.
Moving toward His light, not the darkness.
Reading His word, not wasting time on books that have nothing to do with Him, and who He is. I could never, as a christian, justify spending any amount of time on any of these types of books or movies.


Wow.

FTR, I haven't read HP and have no desire to do so. However, your statement, especially the part I bolded, seems to imply that it's a sin to ever read anything other than the Bible or a book that is related to Biblical teaching. Is that what you meant to say?

If so, I'll have to disagree. To pick a silly example, I read my kids, "Green Eggs and Ham." There's nothing remotely spiritual about that book - it has "nothing to do with Him and who He is." However, it's not wrong to spend time reading it.

While I personally won't read HP, I don't see how I can bind that on someone else. I see this as an issue similar to those discussed in the early verses of Romans 14.

Just another opinion.


Blessings,
Elise


Wife to Dan
Retired homeschool mom to Emily and Bryan
Academic Resource Tutor at a local high school - basically Mom-at-the-kitchen-table for about 50 students
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710050 is a reply to message #710047 ] Thu, 28 July 2011 22:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Lisa R.  is currently offline Lisa R.
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Well-stated, Elise.


Blessings,
Lisa R.
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710071 is a reply to message #708242 ] Thu, 28 July 2011 23:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jamie
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Am I the only one not reading Hope as inclusively condemning everything outside scripture? Or that she is the one that sets the standard of holiness? Honestly, where is this coming from? It's not a conversation or debating of opinions at this point.


Peace
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710075 is a reply to message #710071 ] Fri, 29 July 2011 00:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Elise  is currently offline Elise
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Jamie wrote on Thu, 28 July 2011 22:47

Am I the only one not reading Hope as inclusively condemning everything outside scripture? Or that she is the one that sets the standard of holiness? Honestly, where is this coming from? It's not a conversation or debating of opinions at this point.


Hi Jamie, as I stated in my post above, her statement that I bolded in that post ("Reading His word, not wasting time on books that have nothing to do with Him, and who He is.") seemed to imply that reading any thing not related to Bible teaching is wrong and a waste of time. That's where I got that idea. I did ask for clarification on that point, but she hasn't chosen to do so.

Also, while I know it's hard to discern in written communication, her tone SEEMED to be harsh and judgmental. The first sentence, "It absolutely stuns me anytime I hear a christian talking about reading Harry Potter or Twilight, or anything similar," made me think she was saying one can't really be a Christian and read these books.



[Updated on: Fri, 29 July 2011 00:07]


Blessings,
Elise


Wife to Dan
Retired homeschool mom to Emily and Bryan
Academic Resource Tutor at a local high school - basically Mom-at-the-kitchen-table for about 50 students
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710082 is a reply to message #710071 ] Fri, 29 July 2011 04:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Elizabby  is currently offline Elizabby
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Jamie wrote on Fri, 29 July 2011 13:47

Am I the only one not reading Hope as inclusively condemning everything outside scripture? Or that she is the one that sets the standard of holiness? Honestly, where is this coming from? It's not a conversation or debating of opinions at this point.


Quote:

just stating the fact that reading things like this is not at all pleasing to the Lord,


I think that comment speaks for itself. Claiming to know the Lord's own mind and to dictate to the consciences of others? Sounds pretty judgmental to me.

Where is this coming from? It's right there in her own post. If she chooses to come back and say she didn't mean it that way, I'm prepared to listen, but I mentioned in my first comment that I thought she was coming across as "somewhat" judgmental Wink but her response was essentially "no I'm not, I'm just right and you're going against the Lord's will for all Christians..." Confused

Is there anything unclear in that? I think she's communicated her point of view, very clearly, twice. But I reserve the right to disagree... Wink


Your sister in Christ,

Elizabby

Evie is six, Zoe is four, and Benji is two!

Not online as much these days, contact me through email or my blog if you want to talk to me!
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710177 is a reply to message #710071 ] Fri, 29 July 2011 16:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
blessedwithboys  is currently offline blessedwithboys
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Jamie wrote on Thu, 28 July 2011 23:47

Am I the only one not reading Hope as inclusively condemning everything outside scripture? Or that she is the one that sets the standard of holiness? Honestly, where is this coming from? It's not a conversation or debating of opinions at this point.



I read it as you did, Jamie.

And, actually, I agree with Hope. I think there are many "gray" areas that can be left up to each of us to decide if it's pleasing to God and if we should be involved in these things, but I believe that we can know how God feels about witchcraft through His word...therefore making it a black/white issue.


~It is well with my soul...
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710830 is a reply to message #708315 ] Wed, 03 August 2011 01:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sister P  is currently offline Sister P
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Hey! I've wondered about this because of the trappings I've seen sold under the Harry Potter banner. "The magic that is talked about in the book is not like magic in real life."

So there are no incantations? This would be a "freak out" point for me. I briefly played with witchcraft when I was young and even when the SMURFS said incantations, they made me grab for the remote! I was a Christian when I was doing this and the Lord made it very clear that this was no "fun", no "game", no "joke" to be messed with.

OTOH, if the Harry Potter books are no "worse" than The Lord of the Rings, say, or Narnia... ?
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710833 is a reply to message #710830 ] Wed, 03 August 2011 03:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Elizabby  is currently offline Elizabby
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Sister P wrote on Wed, 03 August 2011 15:32

Hey! I've wondered about this because of the trappings I've seen sold under the Harry Potter banner. "The magic that is talked about in the book is not like magic in real life."[/color]

So there are no incantations?


Not really. They say the "magic word" which is in pig Latin usually but it seems to be the wave of the magic wand which does the trick. If I remember correctly. But also you need to have the magic "in your blood" for it to work. In this sense it isn't an occult summoning of power but the exercise of an inborn talent - I think this is what people mean by "different" from real life.

Quote:


OTOH, if the Harry Potter books are no "worse" than The Lord of the Rings, say, or Narnia... ?


That is kind of difficult to answer. I happen to *love* Narnia and LOTR and *hate* HP, so I might not be the best person to answer it. But I would say that Narnia and LOTR are very clearly *fantasy* novels. They are set in (duh) Narnia and in Middle-Earth, which is clearly not "here". HP is located much more noticeably in this world. The difference is that Narnia and LOTR are stories about the struggle between good and evil, which takes place in a magical fantasy setting. Just about everyone is magical, so isn't a "special power" and it certainly isn't occult (in the sense of summoning or calling on powers from other places). HP is also about the struggle between good and evil - it just depends on whether it fits with your world-view that a wizard with a wand is the "good" character.

In terms of the writing, no question, HP is *much* "worse" than other fantasy classic literature! It is pitched at teenagers, or slightly younger and reminds me more of Enid Blyton's school adventures than classic fantasy. I also have issues with the morality and character development shown in the books. In Narnia and LOTR, the main characters grow and learn moral lessons - important life lessons. Both also have strong themes of self-sacrifice in order to do good. HP (IMHO) is more in the "superhero" genre - other people make sacrifices so that Harry can win. People have also talked about its morality (which I would describe as "the ends justifies the means") in terms of "all's fair in war" and that this is war in which Harry is justified in anything that lets him win. I have strong objections to that utilitarian philosophy and think it has no part in the upbringing of any Christian child, or the forming of any Christian mind, for that matter!

Narnia teaches the exact opposite - when the children are trapped underground in the power of the Underworld, they are reminded that obedience to Aslan (Jesus) is still their first duty, regardless of what happens to them and even if nobody ever knows. And regardless of their previous DISobedience - every command is a new chance to obey God. They do, and they save the lost prince and it all turns out well - but it didn't look good for them. This is in "Silver Chair" the 6th Narnia book and one of my favourites! Narnia and LOTR are filled with powerful messages about integrity, character, truth, loyalty and personal sacrifice - I don't see any of that in HP.


Your sister in Christ,

Elizabby

Evie is six, Zoe is four, and Benji is two!

Not online as much these days, contact me through email or my blog if you want to talk to me!
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710843 is a reply to message #710833 ] Wed, 03 August 2011 09:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Robin H.  is currently offline Robin H.
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I very much agree, Elizabby. Thank you. You explain it so well. I think I'll go reread the Silver Chair. It's been a long time. And dd is going to do Literary Lessons from the Lord of the Rings (Christian curriculum) this year for high school English. I'm looking forward to getting into the books again with her. We read them all aloud years ago.

Jesus spoke in parables often. We need stories to "see" things sometimes IMO. And there are none better than these (besides of course the ones Jesus told). Even in the OT, David couldn't see his own sin with Bathsheba till he was told a story.

BT: The "quality of Mercy" speech in Shakespeare's Merchant of Venice has so been weighing on my mind lately. I start to cry when I read that. Just so Biblical and beautiful IMO. Not scripture, of course, but it points us there.


Robin H.

[Updated on: Wed, 03 August 2011 09:15]

Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710852 is a reply to message #710833 ] Wed, 03 August 2011 10:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sister P  is currently offline Sister P
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Just what I needed to hear. Thanks. (And The Silver Chair is one of my favorites, too.) Cool
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710860 is a reply to message #709954 ] Wed, 03 August 2011 10:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sister P  is currently offline Sister P
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Hope wrote on Thu, 28 July 2011 09:48

Not judgemental at all, just stating the fact that reading things like this is not at all pleasing to the Lord, and that is how I base my decisions. I cannot, as a christian, ever justify spending time on something He would not be pleased with. Also, no, I never have read or watched tv or movies that would not please Him. In fact, I almost never spend time with tv or movies, as I have too many other things to do like caring for my family, homeschooling, etc. I choose very carefully what I will watch or read. I never sit down and mindlessly stare at the screen for something to entertain myself, ... only read that which is edifying, and uplifting, and will help grow my faith and understanding of the Lord in some way-so that I can then share with others, serving Him, and sharing the gospel. I won't even read fiction, because I am bored with it. I feel like I don't even have enough time to read His word, because I want to spend so much more time in it than I have, We are called to do that which is holy, and right and just, always moving toward Him, and his ways, not the opposite direction. Just my opinion, and it works for me, as I am also a model for my children, and in raising children, I am actually raising adults, and I want them to learn discernment in this very selfish "me" society we live in, so I have to be very intentional in all I do, including the books I choose to read, and what I choose to watch/and, or entertain myself with.


I am humbled by your heart, Hope. I have fallen into the trap of filling my "empty" time with watching tv. We don't have "tv" but we do have a good supply of dvd's including several series. Am I spending as much time in the Word or prayer as I am watching those? NO! My granddaughter is living with us this next year and I just told her yesterday that we are watching WAY too much tv, yet we often "don't get around" to our time with the Lord. I'm glad I read your post at this time. Smile
Re: Harry Potter Poll #1 [message #710871 is a reply to message #710860 ] Wed, 03 August 2011 11:21 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Hope  is currently offline Hope
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Oh, I am so glad it was helpful for you! I so agree that asking ourselves the question regarding spending time in His word as much as we are spending time watching t.v., reading fiction, or watching movies is so important. I ask myself this a lot, and it really helps me, as a chrisitian, to keep my priorities straight. Bless you!


"I'd like to ask God why He lets poverty and injustice exist, why there are so many orphans and why He does nothing about it, but I am afraid He would ask me the same question." - Unknown
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